Per discussion in IRC last night, just to note it for those not there... it appears vendors are not charging their fees for BODs for sale in BOD books.
Asked who, when? Telamon did not seem to know about it as of about 7 hours ago. I only actually noticed this because of your BOD book with 4.8M of Bronze deeds for sale. Seemed unlikely you'd be happy about paying 12k a day to have that there.
Well, Telamon said something last night to the effect of "You're right, they're not charging for those... This is going to be annoying to fix." I'm not sure why it wouldn't be a bug... vendors charge for all inventory based on the price set for it. Wouldn't make sense for them to charge for all inventory *except* BODs. I think someone else hinted that they were working on some kind of BOD-matching service being added to the website. I was actually thinking there might be some way to do it via Google Docs spreadsheets or something. In any case, given the potentially high value of these things (and really, most high-ticket rares), it would make the most sense to arrange sales ahead of time and then put them on a vendor briefly to be purchased.
Thank the heavens, I've been biting my tongue from yelling at you about outrageously overpriced BoDs. Can I make you a list of what I want from it and we can haggle it out? Sweeeet.
Interested to see what a flat rate would look like. Certainly we cannot be charged a % of the value of the books? Lamar might have to just stay on vacation.
Why not? That's how it works with every item on every vendor. It's a flat % of the price you set. Am I missing something?
We're hypothesizing here, but I don't think that's true. The reason you say that, presumably, is because you have the BODs priced highly since it costs you nothing right now. If you actually had to pay normal vendor fees, I assume you'd either try to move them more quickly (lower prices, more advertising, etc.), or the alternative you suggest which is you'd stop using vendors for them. But I don't think you should be so quick to dismiss the possibility of simply lowering prices to help them move faster. If they sell for 3750 right now, maybe they settle in at 3000 if you're being charged fees. That way they move more quickly, and at that lower price I have more incentive to speculate and buy some BODs sooner than I otherwise would. I don't believe BOD sellers are going to give up this easy profit source because it becomes slightly less profitable...
Can we agree that if you listed all of your BODs for 10 gp, they would sell immediately? Yes, we can, since I'd buy them all myself. So you would basically pay 0% vendor fees on them because I'd buy them immediately. So naw, price would change how quickly they sell. A happy medium where you maximize profit would be somewhere between 10gp and whatever you charge now. I do not believe there is some inherent quality about BODs that make them worthy of a completely different vendor system. You are simply being rational right now and maximizing your profit based on the fact that you have no disincentive to list them at the most someone will possibly, eventually, pay. If you only sell 5 of your 1500 per day, then yes when vendor fees begin, you will either remove them from your vendor or you will lower your prices. Pirul has no problems selling his BODs almost immediately. Twice I've visited his vendor within an hour of his post, and the ones that will sell have sold already. And the ones that won't are sitting there for a long time. As sellers, what you guys will need to do is be able to determine which BODs fall into which of those two categories (I suspect you already know this), and alter your prices based on this. As you say, time is money. Presumably this would mean individual BOD prices would go down, and BOD reward prices would go up. The market will adjust to anything.
Why are you so angry? I noticed a bug in-game, so I reported it. I'm sorry its correction would harm your business which, as currently set up, is taking advantage of this bug. I've tried to offer alternative ideas about how you might adjust if/when this bug is corrected. You and others seem to think you have some kind of god-given right to sell BODs in whatever manner you choose, and the game mechanics should be molded around that. I disagree. I think your manner of selling the BODs should be molded around the mechanics of the game. Which, amusingly, is what you're currently doing right now. I've been here less than two months, which limits what I can accomplish and experience in this shard thus far. But it doesn't mean I haven't ever PvPed, ran a vendor, etc., during the 13 years we've all been playing this game with the exact same mechanics. I mean, literally, we've all sought out a shard that uses a basic ruleset that has stayed static for 13 years and counting. "Dude I've been doing this for a year", in that context, isn't terribly authoritative. In less than two months here, I've: - discovered a vendor bug - figured out the impact of pack instinct on 6+ pets - extensively tested the Remove Traps skill and reported results to Telamon/Ezekiel - made a meaningful entry in the house decorating contest, that got a few votes - won a prize in the screenshot contest - analyzed the optimum path to GM blacksmith (corrections coming to your guide soon, stay tuned) - added insights into the Treasure Hunting and Taming guides - placed a fortress on empty land - discovered a bug/quirk with monster HP values - detailed numerous Bestiary statistic corrections - corrected various Guides on weapon values, swing speeds, and the influence of STR and DEX on swing speed and damage values - offered a table of monster, monster ID, and avg. gold drop to help future website leaderboard ideas Not a bad first two months, if I do say so myself, and hopefully a fair indication that I put some meaningful time and effort into this game and this shard, and my opinions thereof. You're welcome to get the last word here if you desire; I'm tired of the bickering and the-sky-is-falling mentality that's followed the initial description of the issue. If I have anything new to add about the bug description/report, I will, but I think it's pretty simple.
Meh, I can't resist, sorry: ... * * * * * On the topic at hand, as mentioned earlier in the thread, ...so I find it hard to reconcile your recollection with the conversation this week. Do you understand why I thus put this in the Bug Reports forum, and am calling it a bug? Do you realize what I call it has nothing whatsoever to do with you and your business practices?
I have zero interest in you individually. All three threads you mention - the metals thread, the BOD thread, and the Vendor thread - I had already made comments prior to you showing up. So I'm not sure why you think I care about you specifically. There are dozens of people taking advantage of this bug, including the most morally upright folks I've ever come across in UO... and in no way did I ever express any kind of moral judgment upon this behavior. It's a statement of fact, and I'd do the same thing if it was a quirk of the game that wasn't expressly banned by the staff/rules. I mean, you explictly said: Likewise, I criticized Mutumbo's BOD suggestions long before you entered the fray. Your suggestions are mathematically correct, I've not argued that. The implications of your suggestions had not been fleshed out, so I offered a few mathematically factual counter examples of what worried me about your proposal. When you first started clogging threads with off-topic personal criticisms towards me, I suggested you either speak to me via PM about them, or add me as "Foe", rather than pollute the thread. Since then, I thought we've had some pretty good discussions. But if you somehow interpret them as personal attacks on you, then perhaps it is best you've taken me up on this suggestion.